We're all, you know, the Native people of the Americas, all of the people who have come with a dream, with a recipe, with a hope, like we're all longing to belong.

Mm-hmm.

And we're all hankering for a home.

Mm-hmm.

And we all have incredible food to share.

Well, thank you for joining us on the program.

I'm Tom McNamara.

We are thrilled to welcome a wonderful friend and a big part of Southern Arizona in a special way.

She is a chef, an author, and a TV host on PBS.

You've undoubtedly seen her.

She hosts three programs, Pati's Mexican Table, La Frontera, and Pan Americana, all about the people and the culture and the cuisine of the places she visits.

She's all about the border and La Frontera.

She is Pati Jinich And I wanna welcome you back to Southern Arizona because you're a regular here, Patti.

Thank you so much.

Good to see you.

And welcome you back to the city of gastronomy.

That's quite a feather in our cap for a long time now.

2015, we became, as you know, the first US city of gastronomy.

San Antonio followed a few years later.

And we were all thrilled.

I'm looking out, we have a studio audience for the very first time.

And I wanna thank all you folks for coming and joining us.

You guys, if these were Mexico people, we would be like, whoa!

Yeah, oh, let's go, let's hear it, yeah!

But that was a nice feather in our cap because it just endorsed the cuisines of this region, the traditions, the sustainability, all the things that UNESCO looks for.

As a top chef, as someone at the top of their game who knows more about this than anyone.

What does that say to you that some place is a city of gastronomy?

First of all, thank you for having me, Tom.

To me, it means that this place has something unique and distinct and something that contributes to the world of gastronomy with a deep soul in a deep way.

It's not that suddenly there's a new vision, it became viral, it's that there's a solid history and that there's a solid personality and that it's different from all the others.

And I do find these in Tucson incredibly fascinating.

Every time I come back, I dig into a deeper layer of its food and the people.

So Tom, the first time that I came was for actually the first episode that I did for Pati's Mexican Table where I combined Mexico and the US.

So you know, Pati's Mexican Table, I started because as a Mexican living in the US, I wanted to bring the Mexico that I missed into the US and I wanted to help people understand what we Mexicans' food culture are and how we enrich the table.

And so I go to one region of Mexico, explore it and come back to my kitchen.

And I think I was like in season seven or eight and I had done other usual suspects that were familiar to me like Oaxaca, Puebla, Mexico City, Yucatan.

And then I met Felipe Garcia, who's the president now of Visit Tuson at the Fresh Produce of Association of the Americas conference in Tuvac.

It was my first time in the region and he was there and he's this Mexican like me who lives in the US like me and he's telling me all these wonderful things about the Mexican food in Tucson and how I need to come.

And I'm in complete disbelief.

I'm like, what do you mean?

Like north of the border, I was so ignorant Tom, realizing all the things that I didn't even know about my country, you know, I started to go to places that I hadn't gone before.

And he intrigued me because someone who's Mexican proud at the same time, Tuscon proud and really promoting, you know, the food and the culture of a place.

So I did the first episode, it was called Tuscon Gateway To Sonora.

I don't know if you've watched that show, we don't get it.

Yeah.

And it was like, it opened my mind into, hey, wait a minute, I don't have to feel guilty for loving two places at the same time.

Because by then, my three boys were born in the US and they're American and I had switched careers to a career that I absolutely adore.

And unbeknownst to me, I started growing really deep roots in this country.

And I used to say, oh, I'm happily torn or am I torn?

When I did my citizenship ceremony, I felt like such a traitor, like sorry, Mexico, you know.

And then it was like really like a breaking, like Como Síz un parte, was like a really definite moment in my career in my personal life where I was like, wait a minute, I love these two places just as much and by sharing one in the other, I'm strengthening my roots to Mexico, but I'm also able to grow roots here because I'm bringing the gifts of what I love.

And I came to Tucson and ate all the Mexican food that I could.

Don't blame ya.

And I was in awe how fantastic it was.

And then I loved the food so much and you know, 26 minutes you can do so much.

And so I was like, man, we need to come back.

So I came back and we did another full on episode of Patís Mexican Table in Tucson as a Mexican, taking the pulse of Mexican food here.

Cause the first one we don't get right, it was, you know, his bread, which is so wonderful, is made with Sonoran wheat.

Another James Beard winner.

(Patti) Yes!

And so it was about, look, these guys here making these Tucsonian bread with Sonoran wheat, how collaboration brings about beautiful things.

And that's really what it's all about.

It's about the local culture, but the crops, the traditions, the essence.

And I know you're all about food connects.

And one of the places you want to connect with, your home, first home, Mexico City, now you're living in Maryland, but you're in the US.

How are we doing on that level, that food connects people?

I really love your question.

It's very insightful.

Challenging too.

Because I think, you know, I'm the eternal optimist, Tom.

You know how they say, there's some people who see the glass, half full, some see it, have empty.

I see it overflowing all the time.

Like I'm the eternal optimist.

And I think we have very challenging times in terms of politics, in terms of environment, in terms of what we're all, you know, tackling all new things, the pandemic, the age of AI.

But at the same time, I love seeing that the American audience and the American palette in the US and in the entirety of the Americas, really, which is what Pan Americana is about, is so much more open to welcome and embrace and experience Mexican food and culture and people, despite the politics.

When I moved to the US more than 25 years ago, when I married my husband, we moved to Texas for a few years.

You could find a jalapeno if you were lucky.

And I remember going to the Latino degas and grocery stores and I saw a tomatillo and he was like, oh, thank you God, you know, like, and now you can find every possible dry chili, fresh chili, spices, and all different kinds of cuts of meat special for Mexican food and people love it and embrace it.

And I see that that's the soft power of food.

Some people may say, ah, we really don't eat more Mexicans in the US, but if you're having taco night every Tuesday, I don't know, like, you kind of are liking a part of Mexicans and Mexico and the food.

So I see it with optimism.

You know, before you used to find, yes, you know, some taco restaurants or stands, but these days there's no town that I've touched in the US and yes, I have many more to go, that doesn't have a Mexican food place.

And also it's not a generic Mexican food, it's the Oaxacan, the Pueblan, the modern, the molecular, the homestyle, the seafood.

And so, and that's just like the tippy tip of the iceberg, you know?

Yeah, you've referenced that soft power in previous interviews, tell us more about that.

The soft power that food carries a pretty powerful power, if you will, you know, it's so universal, but how does that sort of soft power work on people?

And you wanna, I know you wanna make a difference, it's one of the reasons you left political science career to make a difference in people's lives.

So how are you working that soft power thing?

So I think, first of all, I love this mug and I'm taking it home, I'm just letting people know.

It's yours, it's yours.

It's really nice and big.

[ LAUGHING ] But anyway, yeah, I switched from political analysis to cooking because first of all, I was homesick.

I was nostalgic, I became really insanely romantic to Mexico, like I had these, because I couldn't go, because I was applying for my work papers, so there's like a limbo time where you can't go until you process those papers.

And so for like a year and a half, I couldn't go and I became very, very nostalgic.

And I was a political analyst, started political science, then did a master's in Latin American studies, had worked in a few policy research centers.

And I was in Washington after, we moved from Dallas to Washington DC, and I was in this policy research think tank.

And I thought it was my dream job.

I always saw myself as someone who'd be wearing glasses, which now I do for reading, and with a stack of papers, and just like helping the world with ideas.

I was a big idealist, I think I still am.

And I come from a long line of refugees into Mexico, and I wanted to help strengthen democratic institutions, civic culture, and what I ran into was a lot of frustration, because every meeting that I went, every conference, every panel, like oh yeah, let's bring people together that don't see eye to eye, and then they leave without seeing eye to eye.

And it's like the same themes, the same, and I was just bored and frustrated, and I felt like what is my life for if I can't make a difference to one person in something.

And I had my three boys by then, I was pregnant with my third, which already counts as Juju was here.

And I didn't want to disappoint, I wanted them to be proud of their mom, and I wanted to give them an example of what you do when you have to move to a different country, and work, and so I switched careers.

Because I realized, first of all, I love eating, second of all, I realized that people can't resist a good played of food.

And people who don't want to have a conversation, but you present that food, and it smells delicious, and it looks incredible, and you're hungry, like you're gonna eat it.

We're animals, we're hungry.

And so I realized that food is that kind of hidden lock door, that if you can open it, and you and I don't like each other, I mean, we like each other, but you and I don't like each other, and you think you don't like the way I think, or the way I dress, or any kinds of views, religious, family, work, whatever values, but you're hungry, and I'm giving you a soup that looks pretty fantastic, and you eat it, it means a lot to me, because that soup means a lot to me.

So the fact that you eat it means that you're accepting me, in a way.

So I have a lot of faith in food, and I think from, of course I'm not changing the world, and I'm just a tiny little grain of sand, but from the feedback that I get from viewers is that, oh they didn't know these or that, oh they didn't know these or that, and that's what doing the show does to me.

It shows me how ignorant I am, and how I'm in awe, because I'm learning something new.

And so if I can do that while, at the same time, give you a solution for what to do on a Wednesday night when you're hungry, and you have a recipe to keep, and to pass on to your family, to your community, then I'm done, you know?

Yeah.

Well you come by it honestly, it's in your genes, because you grew up in Mexico City, in a very loving family with three sisters.

Cooking was a centerpiece of your family, and I read accounts of you as a young girl, helping with the dishes, and also, it was in your genes, and then here you are in a think tank, bored out of your mind, dreaming of ceviche, I love that story.

All you need is ceviche, and Patti get back to work!

I'll tell you.

And the day came where ceviche won over the boss, and it's a great story.

I can share, and it was Mexican pride that triggered that, and why I switched careers really, but I'll tell you something very funny.

When I had two boys, still didn't have Juju, and I was working at this think tank, and was so excited to be working in an office.

You guys, I love, I love having a desk, I love having a printer that I could print things from, I just love things like that.

Made me feel like I belonged somewhere, you know?

And my husband's office was two blocks away from where I got my job, so I started working, and sometimes we'd go at the same time, and it started 8.30 in the morning.

Not a day went by where past 10 a.m.

I'd start calling or texting my husband, I'm hungry, what should we have today?

And I think of the almost two years that I worked there, we had lunch maybe twice together, because he's busy, he's working, he's like, I came back, I brought a sandwich to my office, and I had this romantic idea, this near-du-pond circle, that we'd be trying all the international food together, and I think I went twice with a sandwich to his office to eat it at the same time, but then I went everywhere to have the noodles and the sushi and the middle-distant food, and that was my most joyous part of the day.

So I thought this is depressing, that these half-hour does it for me.

So I'll tell you the story of the trigger.

With the ceviche, I was having a water break, and this colleague of mine, who's Peruvian, told me, you know, but I'm gonna make ceviche or have ceviche, it's Peruvian, and he said, you know, our ceviches are so fantastic, and I said, no, no, Mexican ceviches.

And he said, no, Peruvian ceviches are the original, and they're the good ones, like you guys do, like little salads with ketchup and things, and I was like, no, no, no, we have dozens of different kinds of ceviches, you guys have one.

And I think we actually got to ceviche first.

And he said, no, no, no, we didn't.

So by then, I was supposed to write these, like these full research paper and project on comparing the transition to democracy between Peru and Mexico, very tortured, from Fujimori to the transition to democracy, Mexico from the single party system, the pre to true elections, and I was working on that paper, I was very bored, and it was about Peru and Mexico, and so I was like, wait, maybe I can add a little bit of the ceviches in here, like why not?

So I started researching on ceviches, and why does Peru write ceviche with a B, not a V, why do they really not macerate the fish?

Why do they just, because the Japanese influence, they do very light citrus, and why do we kill the fish with so many spices?

And I ended up writing what I thought was this beautiful paper comparing ceviches, and realizing that neither one of us got it first, that we both were making raw fish with salt, but not with citrus until the Spanish arrived.

And I went to my boss, who actually is now one of my closest friends, Michael Shifter, he always laughs and he says, thank you, I gave you a dreary job, so now you have a great career, you're welcome.

I went to Michael and I said, and I was pregnant then with Juju, and you know.

Juju, your youngest son, yeah.

My youngest, Julian, yeah.

And so I was like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna be a mother of three, I'm so old, I was like 33, I need to switch, yeah, I was such a baby then.

But I came to Michael and I showed him the paper on ceviches, and I said, I think I need to write for like Saveur, or the Food section of the New York Times, I think I'm of no use to you.

And I resigned, and I did write the paper though, turned out good, because I couldn't live without.

And I enrolled in culinary school, and here I am.

Right there in Maryland, and your boys were all supportive, I've read your husband, Daniel, who you met on a blind date, and you didn't like blind dates.

I hated blind dates.

Oh my gosh, I hated blind dates, that's the thing I have three older sisters, and all of them got married very young.

My parents divorced, you know, in that process when I was an early teen, so my parents divorced very young, went on to do their lives again, redo their lives again, my sisters married really fast, and I was like these, I was a loner, I was like a nerd, I wanted to be an academic, and I also had a boyfriend that everybody hated, you know, for a long time, these kind of awful, on and off things.

And my sisters were really worried, I wanted to apply to come do graduate studies here in the US, because oh America, the US.

And my sisters were like, Patti's gonna move to the US, we're gonna lose her, it's wild in the US, we need to keep her here.

So they started introducing me to all these people.

Oh, to keep you there, yeah.

To keep me there, and the thing is, I have three older really beautiful sisters, so every guy that introduced me had wanted to go out with one of them, or had gone out with one of them, and it was pretty awful, so I told my sisters no blind dates ever again, I'm gonna meet a foreigner, when I moved to the US, it's gonna be someone different, enough with these Mexican guys that wanna date my sisters.

And so my brother-in-law called me, he was desperate, this is very traditional, he called me and he said, "You know, Patti, I know you don't like blind dates, "but I have this really good friend, "who I was supposed to go out with him "and his girlfriend and my sister, and he said, let me know if I'm going to in the weeds.

But so, he said, "I was distracted, and I told him that you'd go out with him, like so sorry, like don't make me look bad.

And so I said, "Okay, fine."

I said, "When's he gonna call?"

And he said, "He'll call tomorrow, he's smart, "he's funny, like please."

And I said, "Okay, I promise, if he calls, I'll go out."

He didn't call.

Didn't call, like a month goes by, and I'm deeply insulted.

So I'm telling my coworker, I said yes to a guy, I don't know, and this is his name, and what's wrong with this guy?

And so my friend tells me, "Oh, don't go out with Daniel Hinnich, you know, "he's a charmer, he's funny, he's smart, "he has a girlfriend that he loves, "and they're on and off."

And I had been in an on and off thing too, but had broken up with my boyfriend then, and she said, "You know, he loves these girls so much, "and every time they break up, she goes like this, "he goes back, so you're gonna go out with him, "you're gonna really like him, "and you have not a shot, Pati."

And I was like, wait until he calls.

Like if he calls me once, we just need to go out once.

Like by then, I had done all the research on who this guy was.

So by the time he called me, Tom, I was sold.

So he called me like a month later, and I was in already, because he took so long.

So we went out on a blind date, and he told me that he didn't believe in marriage, that marriage was a failed institution.

And I was like, oh, whoa, this is a modern liberal man, which is not common in Mexico.

And I said, oh, that's interesting, but I find the conversation super fascinating, and he's charming, and he's funny, and two weeks later he proposed.

And I was like, what about that?

And today he says, we're going on 30.

This year will be our 30th anniversary.

And still he always says, you know, I knew I couldn't give Pati time to think.

So we married within a year, and he's been very supportive of my change of career, though supportive, he's my biggest fan, but he's my toughest critic by far, which I think is good to have those things sometimes.

Too tough, yeah.

(Pati) Sometimes.

He couldn't meet you for lunch, because he's a financial guy, right?

He can't leave the office while the markets are open or something.

He's pounding the phones and everything, so he couldn't meet you for lunch.

But between the two of you, three taste testers right in the house, and you worked those guys well coming up with the cuisine.

Your boys are expert in many ways, and they grew up pretty nicely with a mom who does what you do.

I feel incredibly blessed, incredibly blessed that he has been so supportive and so loving.

And he eats absolutely everything that I've put on his plate, and I'm a good cook now.

I wasn't a good cook then.

Really?

I was a terrible, awful, dreadful cook, because I love salt, and I'm very enthusiastic with life and with food, and I tend to oversee some things.

And so he's eaten a lot of not great things, and I had to learn my way.

I mean, I went to cooking school, but then I needed to go and explore and taste and try in the different regions of Mexico, and so there's been a lot of hit and miss.

And my boys too, I mean, they will eat everything too, but if I want an opinion, they will tell me.

And I love honesty, like my boys are my best friends truly, and they're incredible cooks, which is the best thing about having grown-up kids is that, you know, of course, now we're empty nesters, and I see many friends of ours who are empty nesters, and they're downsizing, and they're moving to other places, and they are doing all these new things, and I'm like, I'm not moving.

I tell Danny, do not touch the rooms, because they come back, and they come up with their friends, and they love cooking, and the great thing is that now that they're adults, you know, you have them, you raise them the best way you can, and you think you're teaching them, and you're giving them life advice, and then the crazy thing is I'm learning so much from them, like such basic things that I should know really.

Like sometimes my kids tell me something, and I'm like, oh my gosh, they're so right.

Why didn't I know this?

I know what you mean, I know exactly what you mean.

I have three girls, you have three boys.

Oh really, so how old are yours?

20-- Matchmaking, matchmaking 28, 26, 24.

Are you kidding me?

Three beauties in a row, so we should-- Well excuse me, mine are pretty handsome too.

All right, so here we go, okay, we'll talk after our interview.

I have 27, 24, and 20.

They would die of embarrassment Don't keep these in place.

It almost aligns perfectly, doesn't it?

Age-wise, it almost aligns perfectly.

You said you weren't a great cook, you went to cooking school in Maryland at the French place, I won't try to pronounce it.

L'Academie de Cuisine That place, yeah.

And then-- Which closed actually, I think after I went, they were like, we're done.

Oh yeah.

(laughing) Can't keep these open, yeah.

You traumatized them.

Then you kind of threw yourself into the high pressure cooker.

You were cooking for some VIPs in Washington, not the Mexican consulate, but a Mexican institute.

And so you kind of threw yourself in there, and I imagine you had to learn pretty quick to put something good on the plate.

That is the place of ignorance, Tom.

Like really, people tell me, if you knew then what you know now, would you do it again?

And even though I wouldn't change a thing, I love where I'm standing so much right now, I love what I do so much right now, but I wouldn't do it again, Tom, if I knew, because the obstacles were insane, and the challenges were insane.

And I think I was able to do it because I didn't know what I was getting into, you know?

Develop a culinary program for the Mexican cultural institute.

Of course I knew research, of course I knew Mexico, but then I had to sell the space.

No marketeer, I had no media training, and I had to go on radio and TV shows, which is actually how I found my love for the microphone.

Because I went on radio shows, local radio shows and TV stations, to promote the classes, because I had a responsibility to fill the room.

Yeah, I had no idea what I was doing.

Like when I think about it, I was like, how was I not embarrassed or worried?

And I think it's because I switched careers already a little bit late.

I had more to lose, and less time to do it.

So I just gave it gas.

And here you are.

And you know, you're so typical, I think of a lot of people who are stars, celebrities, if you will.

You're self-described loner, a nerd, you know, but you found that passion, and you had the courage to segue at a certain point in life.

And you know, you've been learning this on the job, but it just brings you tremendous success, I guess, when you're true to yourself, and true to your calling, and true to life, don't you think?

(Pati) I--absolutely.

And I think I've really stuck to some core values that have guided me throughout, which, you know I was invited to give the commencement speech when my oldest son graduated high school, which I'll share this story, because it was a little stressful.

You know, when the principal told me, I was like, yeah, sure, I'll do it.

And my husband came to me, and he said, "Patty, you know commencement speeches, "or keynote speeches, whatever they're called, "here in the US are important.

"Like, they mean a lot, they're printed, "they go on websites, they go on books."

Long, yeah.

You can't wing it.

Because I'm unscripted, I'm really good at unscripted.

Right.

And he said, "You can't wing it."

And I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And he says, "I know you're gonna wing it.

"You can't wing it."

And like, a couple days later, he put on my desk this book that was like the 100 best commencement speeches in the United States of America.

And I started reading them, and I was like, oh man, I feel like I need to write an essay for my master's.

And of course, I asked Ivan if he was okay with me speaking to all his friends, and he thought about it, and he says, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's great Ma.

And so I worked on that speech for like three months, and I called the principal, and I said, is it okay if we have a screen behind when I talk so that I can refer to the food?

You know, and he was like, why?

I built this speech, and why, you know, in life, you have to be more of a marble pound cake.

Then, like, I have this photo of a chocolate cake that I did with Juju with crepes, where every crepe is perfect, and there's a layer, and there's chocolate ganache in between.

And I said, you know, I found that life is more like a marble pound cake than the perfect stack, because you have to, you know, you never know what you're gonna get in a slice of a good marble pound cake, like where the chocolate's gonna go.

And in my giving advice to kids, I said, you know, first of all, don't do the research, which the parents were like, the audience, because if you do too much research, you're freezing your tracks.

If you really wanna do something, and you research all the obstacles, all the competition, like, you're not gonna do it.

So yeah, okay, do some research, but don't kill yourself with exploring what are the obstacles, what do you wanna do?

But about this core value that has driven me is never put on the negotiating table the things that you can't live without or that would make you lose who you are.

And it's typically the things that people ask you to change.

It can be loved ones, it can be friends, it can be, you know.

And if you put that on the negotiating table, you're not gonna recognize yourself.

And for me, that's always been the case.

You know, don't do a Mexican cooking show, do international, Mexican is too niche, change your accent, it's too heavy, people are not gonna know what you're saying.

And throughout my career, you know, so many doors were closed, because I was too Mexican, or my accent was too much, or my hair should have been more red, because the US would like that more.

Or, you know, it was one thing after the other.

And I think that is something that has helped me dearly, you know.

And you're giving that advice.

You were quoted in an interview, you get as many people wanting questions and say things about your programs, as you do career advice.

And one of the pieces you gave, especially for young women, was don't be afraid to zigzag through career and life like you have.

When you talk about the non-negotiables and the flexibilities and all that, you're a life coach now as well, which is pretty cool.

You know, I, first of all, thank you for doing so much research.

This is a wonderful interview, you're asking me incredible questions, that means a lot.

Easy, you bring it all out so easily.

No, thank you, thank you.

You're such a joy.

But I do think that increasingly we're forced to choose between A or B. And we're forced to choose what box and what label we belong in.

And we're forced to choose, you know, all these books, like what do you wanna see exactly 10 years from now and what are the steps to get there?

Like, you know?

And your bucket list before you die, you know?

Like all these, and I guess for some people it may be helpful to have some of it, but I think we become slaves of that mentality.

And then if we are not forgiving and kind and understanding with our changing selves, how can we be with others?

I think we also stick to what we think we need to be or what we once were.

Listen, when I moved to the US, if you call me a Mexican American, that would deeply insult me.

I would say, no, no, no, no, no, I'm a Mexican and I'm living in the US, great country, but I'm a Mexican.

And almost 30 years later, I have three Mexican American boys.

I've built a beautiful life here in the US.

I have just as deepest and strong roots to both countries.

And I feel a responsibility to do right by both.

And I happily call myself a Mexican-American.

And never in my life before, you know, I feel like maybe five or six years ago, I would never do that.

And we change, we evolve.

And I think if we don't let ourselves have that changing journey, then we're a disappointment to ourselves all the time.

And you want kids that are starting out to know that, I mean, you don't want them switching like mad, like in the young generations these days, you see a lot of, they don't have a lot of the patience to like stick to one job.

But not to go to the extreme that at 18 or 20, you need to know what you need to do to get to what.

So that's my metaphor of the marble pound cake, because some slices have a lot of chocolate, some slices have more vanilla, some slices are drier, you know, if they're on the ends of the-- The heel, yeah.

And some, the best slice is right in the middle, I think.

And especially if it has more chocolate and you eat it with a glass of milk.

(Tom) Bingo!

You kind of, you know, in your life, in your career, getting back to that, you've gone out of your way to pay homage, respect and goodwill toward your first home in Mexico, Mexico City and to your new home, Maryland, USA.

Now, as far as, you know, bridging the cultures and what you try to do with your programs.

And that led to, I know in large part to Pan Americana, where you said, you know, and you trekked all the way up to Alaska, all the way down to Argentina.

And I know you're all familiar with the program because you want to rediscover what it means to be American in the broader sense, 34 countries of America.

What are you finding out about what it means to be American?

I mean, this is, I think, the greatest professional journey of my life truly.

Like, of course I'll continue doing parties, Mexican table.

I love it as long as I can.

But this Pan Americana journey, and I added the A at the end, you know, the Pan American highway is such a metaphor for connection and collaboration between every country and region in the entirety of the Americas.

And there's not one road that goes from the top of Alaska to the bottom of Argentina.

There's a series of roads.

So you kind of choose your own journey.

However you want to go from top to bottom.

Some people have done it from bottom to top.

I wanted to start at the top of Alaska.

And I wanted to invite the viewers to reimagine what it means to be an American in the full sense of the word, because I think that's a win-win for everyone.

I think that makes the US stronger.

You know, why do we in the US call ourselves American?

And we don't like it when other people in other countries call themselves American, and they're all American.

But if we understand our American-ness in the United States, while learning about the other Americas, Colombia, Venezuela, Argentina, Mexico, and we understand them and we get to know them, and we get to know the people, the culture and the food, we can understand ourselves better because our communities are made of people from those countries.

So it is like kind of a self-introspection while going out of your bubble to learn about these places and these people.

And I think if you know yourself as a country better, you're stronger, and then you can have better relationships with the other countries, you know, because you understand them better.

And you're grateful for the Mexicans who are in the US who make amazing tacos.

And you're grateful to the Argentinians who have really good choripan.

It was more, I did the US-Mexico borderlands with La Frontera and connected, you know, my love for Mexico and the US and found their richness in the region.

Pan Americana was more like a dream to find like what has been the lure, what has been the promise of the Americas to people all over the world?

Why did my grandparents who had to flee dreamt of coming to the Americas and many other immigration waves historically?

So what has been that promise and who has that promise been kept for or to, or my English is back sometime?

I don't know, it's fine.

And what I'm finding is, you know, celebrate our differences, find our commonalities.

One recurring theme that I keep finding that you'll see in the Arizona episode is yes, I'm finding all the, you know, Eastern European, Middle Eastern, African, Caribbean, from all parts of the America, et cetera.

But there's one recurring theme, which is the Original People of the Americas from Alaska.

Now I'm ending this episode in Nogales, Arizona.

The original people of the Americas haven't been able to make the Americas they're home fully.

And I think it's a painful, a subject, you know, you have the Alaska Natives, you have the First Nation in Canada, you have the Blackfeet, which we were with, in Montana, you have the Tohono O'odham in Arizona.

And so in the end, it's like this equalizer, equalizer where we're all, you know, the Native people of the Americas.

All of the people who have come with a dream, with a recipe, with a hope, like we're all longing to belong.

And we're all hankering for a home.

And we all have incredible food to share.

So like, how do we connect those things?

And I'm learning so much, Tom.

I mean, it's such an incredible journey.

And one full episode is practically Tucson.

Oh, yeah.

The people, the stories.

I mean, it's Arizona from Phoenix to Nogales, but we met such incredible people, you know, poets, musicians, chefs, artists, a guy that does miniature sculptures, you'll meet him in the episode, Feng-Feng with her Chinese Chorizo project, the descendants of the Mexican Chinese and Chinese grocery store owners in Tuscon.

(Tom) Dozen of them!

Oh, yeah, one time dozens of Chinese grocery stores right down the street here.

Yeah, and they said there were hundreds and now there's four, I think.

And many times I think we fail to see the stories that make us who we are, if we don't get out of them for a second.

So I think that's what Panamericana is doing for me.

And I hope for the viewers that decide to come along for the ride.

And I added the A, you know, it's Panamerican Highway, but I call it Panamericana because I'm a woman taking that journey.

So it's like Panamericana journey.

And so it's fun.

I'm on the road a lot meeting incredible people.

Yeah, you're so joyful and it's such a pleasure to know you and watch you.

And we just immensely appreciate your time coming back to the city of gastronomy in Southern Arizona.

We love it and we're glad you love it as much as we do.

We know how lucky we are.

I love it so much.

You guys, I love Tuscon.

I know I pronounce it weird, but I love Tuscon.

Every time I come back, I find more fascinating people.

I meet more friends and I eat better food.

And I'm waiting for my break to see if I can go eat pizza at that time market, cause now I found that there's really good pizza there and joking maybe later tonight.

But yeah, I always find something new and delicious and love being here.

Thank you guys for coming.

Yeah, and thank you.

We'll be looking forward to your programs and do come back soon, Pati.

It's such a pleasure to see you.

Thank you for having me.

You're a wonderful host.

Thank you.

You're an easy and wonderful guest.

And thanks to our studio audience and thank you for watching.

We'll see you on the next Speaking Personally.